Author Topic: Additional Force Unleashed Feats for SWSE  (Read 525 times)

ben hoenheim

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Additional Force Unleashed Feats for SWSE
« on: October 23, 2013, 12:27:21 pm »
I worship the Force Unleashed  supplement, so I came up with some awesome options to use in your campaign if you like this fiction.

Can any of you guys please tell me if anything is difficult to understand?

Spoiler (hover to show)
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Unleashed Training: You learn one or more Force powers and may use the Force in an outstanding manner. Prerequisites: Force Sensitivity, trained in the Use the Force Skill, Skill Focus (use the Force). Benefit: You add to ypur Force power suite a number of Force powers equal to 1 + your Charisma modifier (minimum 1). You can't add the same power more than once. Special: You can take this feat more than once. Each time you take this fear, you add to ypur Force suite a number of new Force powers equal to your charisma modifier. If your Charisma permanently increases, you inmediatly gain a number of Force powers equal to the number of Unleashed Training feats you have taken. Additionally, if you have the Force Sensitivity feat, you also gain access to Force Unleashed abilities (see page 89 of the Force Unleashed campaign Guide).
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Heroic Surge: You can perform additional actions in a round and may use the Force in an incredible way. Benefit:  You can spend a Destiny point as a free action to gain an immediate standard action, or a Force Point to receive and immediate move or swift action. In addition, you also gain access to Unleashed abilities. Special: iI you have the Force Sensitivity feat, you also gain access to Force Unleashed abilities (see page 89 of the Force Unleashed campaign Guide).
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Spoiler (hover to show)
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Unleashed Surge: You can perform additional actions in a round and stand apart from others, when using the Force. Prerequisites: Force Sensitivity, trained in the Use the Force Skill, Skill Focus (use the Force) and Ability to use Force Secrets and Techniques or Unleashed, and Unleashed Maelstrom. Benefit:  You can spend a Destiny point as a free action to gain an immediate standard action, or a Force Point to receive and immediate move or swift action. In addition, by expending all your ramaining force points; your next Use the Force check automatically overcomes one of your adversarie's defenses, it also moves the taget an additional -2 steps along the condition track (regardless of whether the effect exceeds the targets damage threshold) and, furthermore, you deal additional damage if your check relates to a damaging effect: multiply the damage dealt by 2.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2014, 10:20:55 am by ben hoenheim »
May all your rolls be CRITICAL! D&D maxim

“Never tell me the odds!” ―Han Solo

what I recommend is to live by the die & die by the dice! --Le Ben

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MERC_1

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Re: Additional Force Unleashed Feats for SWSE
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2013, 06:34:39 pm »
While I do like some ideas, the execution is a bit unbalanced. The Unleashed feat is a bit unbalanced to begin with, but many of your suggested feats grant the same access to those abilities, and other powers as well!

If you want to write up some feats that build on the Unleashed feat that is fine, but they should each grant one benefit and all have the Unleashed feat as a prerequisite, and anything else you see fit. Try writing them out in the same maner as the feats in the SECR. That will make judging the feats on a scale where Force Training is the counterweight, so much easier. Why Force Training you may ask, but as some players want to take that feat as often as possible, it is a god comparison. If it is much better then that, then it is probably too strong...

EDIT: Edited for clarity.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2013, 07:20:13 pm by MERC_1 »

ben hoenheim

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Re: Additional Force Unleashed Feats for SWSE
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2013, 03:49:56 am »
 :) IMHO game balancing stands separately than supplementary-variant rules. This because there is delicate "veil" right here, and it the end, it depends entirely on your viewpoint --if you haven't somehow afforded a better view on Force Unleashed material, other than the role-playing source (like FU video-games 1 and 2, the comic and novel for example) its normally expected that you couldn't possibly understand these abilities to the extend of their optimal efficiency.

Not meaning to disrespect traditional Star Wars narrative, nor your opinion: A most imaginative viewpoint would surely would help me out a little bit to maintain this abilities and break on traditional narrative without indeed judging the feats overpowered.

If some reasoning would be develop, you must know that most of these abilities allow your character to draw upon a power that few even dare to understand, the power of the Force Unleashed. Either from the related Feat, or these options. Characters that use the the Force Unleashed are more resilient and powerful than others, and as a result are awe-inspiring in ways their traditional Force-Using counterparts could never match without being an unbalanced adversary for any character on their challenge tier or level.

Example, Unleashed Training, is the counterweight of Force Training but if you have the Force Sensitivity feat, you also gain access to Force Unleashed abilities. Helping you use the occasional FU ability (already balanced by DP expenditure) and not breaking on the calculated risk of having multiple Force Powers since you can only use a Standard action to use one from your suite as normal. As you see, it takes advantage of traditional rules from the SECR and it builds on the Force Unleashed mood specially if you didn't have the game resources to pull this options with your character. However, Mythic Force User could be a treat, but that is entirely up to the gaming group, and how eager are them to build on challenging material.

I'm wondering if you could point out what is specially unbalancing from your opinion, it appears you have some sense of ruling im just beginning to understand; because i cannot see how this ruling could be dangerous to any campaign...whether used by players or GM alike, even defiant to extraordinary narrative as the ruling appears...
 
« Last Edit: December 07, 2013, 03:39:11 pm by ben hoenheim »
May all your rolls be CRITICAL! D&D maxim

“Never tell me the odds!” ―Han Solo

what I recommend is to live by the die & die by the dice! --Le Ben

MERC_1

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Re: Additional Force Unleashed Feats for SWSE
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2013, 07:15:12 pm »
:) IMHO game balancing stands separately than supplementary-variant rules. This because there is delicate veilright here, and it the end, it depends entirely on your viewpoint --if you haven't somehow afforded a better view on Force Unleashed material, other than the role-playing source (like FU video-games 1 and 2, the comic and novel for example) its normally expected that you couldn't possibly understand these abilities to the extend of their optimal efficiency.

[...]

I'm wondering if you could point out what is specially unbalancing from your opinion, it appears you have some sense of ruling im just beginning to understand; because i cannot see how this ruling could be dangerous to any campaign...whether used by players or GM alike, even defiant to extraordinary narrative as the ruling appears...
Actually, I don't think that these would be dangerous to a campaign. No more dangerous then the Unleashed feat is to begin with. This is because that in my view, the ability to use Unleashed powers and abilities are the best part of these feats. I also like that you add a few extra uses for FP in some of the feats.

Some of the uses for DP are on the other hand weak. Yes, I'm looking at you: When any of your attack hits, you deal additional damage equal to one-half your level. Until the end of your next turn. That in not so strong, not unless you use area effect powers. Compare this with the Waveform talent and any talent or weapon that let you add the effect of a FP both to the attack and to the damage. Something that let you add a FP to both Use the Force and the damage of the attack, that would be a cool Feat indeed. Even if that feat had Force Training and Unleashed as prerequisites I would consider spending a rare level based feat slot on picking it up.

To me there is always a important choice, what to do with my level based feat slots. One common choice; at least if playing a force-user, is to pick up force training. A viable alternative if allowed, is to pick up the Unleashed feat instead. My problem here, is that if you want Unleashed and Force Training you have to make a choice. But with your Unleashed Training, you give away Unleashed for free. As the requirements are not very taxing, there is no reason to make this choice ever again. I think my problem with this is of the same type as the problem some people have with the Imperial Knights infamous talent that that gives you the effects of 2 good talents at the price of one... So, if you want to grant the use of Unleashed powers for free, you just go ahead and do that to all the PC in a campaign. But do it as a separate house-rule.

Other things that would be cool: Something that lets you convert 5 FP to one DP; feats that add extra Unleashed options that uses force powers that don't have a unleashed variant yet, or that let you use otherwise mundane feat in a new or stronger way at the cost of a DP; a way to spend more then one FP a turn; anything else that has a similar feel as the unleashed powers already in existence. 


ben hoenheim

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Re: Additional Force Unleashed Feats for SWSE
« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2013, 04:22:10 am »
I've been inspired, and working on this . I have like 4 feats so far,  they will grow on most of what has been discussed and are inspired on some of philosophical standpoints of viewing the Force. I have broken most abilities discussed here, and added a few more. Playtesting gave humonguos results with this options like buring 5 FPs to get an inmediate DP you cannot keep is very exiting.

- Living Force

- Unifying Force

- Force Quickening

- Secrets of the Darkside


I'll elaborate in the following days.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2013, 04:24:56 am by ben hoenheim »
May all your rolls be CRITICAL! D&D maxim

“Never tell me the odds!” ―Han Solo

what I recommend is to live by the die & die by the dice! --Le Ben

MERC_1

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Re: Additional Force Unleashed Feats for SWSE
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2013, 06:16:58 pm »
Cool, but i have a small of topic question if I may:
What is "veilright"?

Whenever I encounter a word that I don't know what it means, I try to look it up. Now I have a hard time finding out the meaning!


ben hoenheim

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Re: Additional Force Unleashed Feats for SWSE
« Reply #6 on: December 07, 2013, 03:42:38 pm »
Cool, but i have a small of topic question if I may:
What is "veilright"?

it was supposed to be as follows:

(...) This because there is delicate "veil" right here, and it the end, it depends entirely on your viewpoint (...)

lol, Im sorry it was a typo. the veil reference was sort of a metaphor regarding how limited  are certain points-of-view ...and how abilities like those represent an innovative narrative.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2013, 06:12:13 pm by ben hoenheim »
May all your rolls be CRITICAL! D&D maxim

“Never tell me the odds!” ―Han Solo

what I recommend is to live by the die & die by the dice! --Le Ben

ben hoenheim

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Re: Additional Force Unleashed Feats for SWSE
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2014, 10:09:05 am »
Thanks to some input by Merch_1, and to some playtesting; I had the opportunity to elaborate on some of those Force Unleashed feats. Here I thought just wanted to let you see my opinion and maybe receive further counseling around.

Unleashed training: You learn one or more Force powers and may use the Force in an outstanding manner. Prerequisites: Force Sensitivity, trained in the Use the Force Skill, Skill Focus (use the Force). Benefit: You add to your Force power suite a number of Force powers equal to 1 + your Charisma modifier (minimum 1). You can't add the same power more than once.  Additionally, if you have the Force Sensitivity feat, you also gain access to Force Unleashed abilities (see page 89 of the Force Unleashed campaign Guide). Special: You can take this feat more than once. Each time you take this fear, you add to your Force suite a number of new Force powers equal to one plus your charisma modifier. If your Charisma permanently increases, you immediately gain a number of Force powers equal to the number of Unleashed Training feats you have taken.
Normal: You can only learn Force Powers using the Force Training Feat, with your Wisdom modifier, however, you may select the same power more than once if doing so. Additionally, you can only gain access to Unleashed abilities by taking the Unleashed feat.
Spoiler (hover to show)

Unleashed Surge: You can perform additional actions in a round and stand apart from others, when using the Force. Prerequisites: Force Sensitivity, trained in the Use the Force Skill, Skill Focus (use the Force) and Ability to use Force Secrets and Techniques or Unleashed. Benefit: You can spend a Destiny point as a free action to gain an immediate standard action, or a Force Point to receive and immediate move or swift action. In addition, by expending all your remaining force points; your next Use the Force check automatically overcomes one of your adversary's defenses, it also moves the target an additional -2 steps along the condition track (regardless of whether the effect exceeds the targets damage threshold) and, furthermore, you deal additional damage if your check relates to a damaging effect: multiply the damage dealt by 2.

Spoiler (hover to show)

Heroic Surge: You can perform additional actions in a round by using the Force to your advantage in a peculiar way. Benefit: On your turn, you can spend a Destiny point as a free action to gain an immediate standard action, or a Force Point to receive and immediate move or swift action. In addition, you also gain access to Unleashed abilities, but not Unleashed Force Abilities. Special: If you have the Force Sensitivity feat, you also gain access to Force Unleashed abilities (see page 89 of the Force Unleashed campaign Guide).
Normal: You can only gain access to Unleashed abilities by taking the Unleashed feat.
Spoiler (hover to show)
« Last Edit: January 02, 2014, 10:12:55 am by ben hoenheim »
May all your rolls be CRITICAL! D&D maxim

“Never tell me the odds!” ―Han Solo

what I recommend is to live by the die & die by the dice! --Le Ben